Parks, Public Utilities & Technology Committee 7/23/2025

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One, two.

Good afternoon, everyone.

The July 23rd, 2025 meeting of Parks Public Utilities Technology Committee will come to orders, also known as the PUT, well, PPUT Committee.

It is 2.03 p.m.

I'm Joy Hollingsworth, Chair of the Committee.

Chair, will you please call the roll?

Councilmember Kettle?

Here.

Councilmember Rivera?

Present.

Councilmember Strauss?

Council President Nelson?

Present.

Chair Hollingsworth?

Here.

There are four Councilmembers present.

Awesome, thank you council members and thank you council member Rivera, came in hot today, so thank you.

Colleagues, today we're gonna hold a public hearing on the Seattle Public Utilities land use and zoning for solid waste.

And we're also gonna hear from our phenomenal Seattle, let me just say that our phenomenal Seattle Public Utilities, I don't want anyone fighting between Seattle Public Utilities and parks.

Phenomenal Seattle Public Utilities land use and zoning, and then also our phenomenal Parks Department about two different concession agreements.

We're gonna now consider the agenda.

If there's no objection, the agenda will be adopted.

Hearing none, the agenda is adopted.

With that, we're gonna move right into the hybrid public comment period.

Public comments should be related to items on today's agenda or be within the purview of the committee.

Again, there is a public hearing for item number one, which is Council Bill 121005, and that public hearing will begin shortly after the public comment period.

If your comments relate to item one, please hold your comments until we open the public hearing.

Clerk, how many speakers do we have signed up today?

Currently, we have two in-person speakers and there is one remote speaker.

Awesome.

Everyone's going to get two minutes.

Please read the instructions for the public comment period and we will get started.

Thank you.

The public comment period will be moderated in the following manner.

Speakers will be called in the order in which they are registered on the council's website and the signup sheet available here in council chambers, starting with in-person speakers first.

If you have not registered to speak but would like to, you can sign up before the end of public comment period on the council's website.

The link is listed on today's agenda or by signing up on the signup sheet at the front of chambers.

When speaking, please begin by stating your name and the item that you are addressing.

Speakers will hear a chime when 10 seconds are left of the allotted time.

If speakers do not end their comments at the end of the allotted time provided, the speaker's microphone will be muted to allow us to call on the next person.

And let the record reflect we're joined in person by Councilmember Strauss.

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you.

Oh yeah, we're ready for the first speaker.

The first speaker for in-person public comment is Maggie Johnson, followed by Alex Zimmerman.

Hello and thank you for this opportunity.

I'm Maggie Johnson and I'm a volunteer for the Urban Nature Guide for Seattle Parks Environmental Education Program.

First of all, we are so grateful to you, the council and to the mayor's office for deciding that our program is critically important for the youth of our city and must be saved.

You included funding for maintaining our staff positions, our nine staff positions in the school levy.

But we thought you might want to know that our parks administration doesn't seem to be on board.

We understand that our current program manager has been instructed to make a work plan for next year for only It appears that Parks is planning to divert funding for the five positions that were approved by you in Councilmember Strauss's levy amendment for other purposes.

While the mayor's office has assured us that Parks supports its environmental education program, in fact, Parks continues to try to dismantle it.

Parks has never shared what their attitude or plans are for environmental education, not with you, the council, nor with the affected staff, volunteers, our community partners, and our tens of thousands of program participants.

I have a request.

I understand you don't have direct control over parks operations, but could this committee request a presentation from parks about their plans for environmental education and specifically what they plan to do with the levy budget should it pass?

Thank you.

Thank you so much.

Next we have Mr. Alex Zimmerman.

Here is me.

Thank you very much.

Yeah, very appreciative.

Yeah, yeah, I'm ready.

My name is Alex Zimmerman.

I want to speak about agenda number two, about PARC.

For many years, many years, I'm talking we don't need to spend money for PARC.

We spent a billion dollars for PARC.

Why?

Why we spend $4 billion for Park and 1,000 employees, 1,000 employees who work for Park?

Why?

When we have too much money, I don't understand, and nothing changed.

So I think, why nothing changed?

Before we not fire Mayor Harrell, you know what it means, who's been in this place for 16 years, nothing will be changed.

It's very critical.

It absolutely needs money for every problem that we have.

Homeless, social security, disabled like me, we need money for the people, not for the tree.

You know what it means?

And I'm confused about rules that have tree.

Every dog can...

Peace and tree and human cannot.

It's a pure discriminatory.

It's very important, guys.

Before we don't clean us government from people like Harrell, so for four years, never have one Q&A in seventh quarter right now.

You know what it means?

In sitting in December for 16 years and bring Seattle to total collapse.

Total collapse.

I live here for 40 years and I speak here for 30 years.

Maybe more, maybe less.

Who cares about it?

We need clean city totally.

We have too many problems.

And Mayor Harrell did bad job for 16 years and for four years.

And after last week, king country take us constitution in garbage.

We need doing much harder what is we have right now.

So we have a Trump, we have a new American revolution, need a common sense.

We're not idiot all of it.

Thank you very much.

Next, we're going to go straight into our virtual public commenters.

Please, when you're off mute, press star six to unmute yourself and you can go ahead with your public comment.

First, we have Adrian Dorff followed by Alberto Alvarez.

Thank you all for being here.

And when you are off mute and start talking, the timer will start.

Good afternoon Seattle City Council members and thank you for the opportunity to provide public comment today.

My name is Adrienne Dorff and I live in the Heller Lake neighborhood of Seattle.

I'm here today to ask you to protect the Magnuson Park wetlands for the wildlife that rely on them and the people who enjoy the peace and quiet that they offer.

The plan to build noisy pickleball courts adjacent to a beloved wetland created with Public tax dollars does not make sense.

Please find another more suitable location for the pickleball courts.

And additionally, I just want to mention that I am a former Seattle Urban Nature Guard with the Parks Department, and I've seen firsthand how important environmental education is to community members, and I hope that you will fund the environmental education, not fund, but support The funding of the environmental education programs at the Parks Department.

Thank you.

Thank you, Adrian.

Next up, we have Alberto Alvarez.

Once you get promoted, please press star six, unmute yourself, and you can go ahead and start with your comment.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Councilmember Hollingsworth, putt-putt golf near Sarah Nelson's million-dollar home is important.

But for over 18 months, Kathy Moore dragged her feet to appoint a fully staffed renter's commission, protecting a golf course for the wealthy on 145th Street, as Rivera was so worried about.

Sure.

But thousands of renters like me are silenced and even threatened with a rollback on winter eviction.

Business groups get all the attention they need to run a concession stand on the beach for the two months of summer we have in this region.

Today, when the Council was set to vote and take action to secure funding for housing and appoint the much-needed renters commission, Sarah Nelson and Rob Saka declined to attend.

We demand an apology from both, a full explanation From Nelson and Sokka, a fast-track correction to this betrayal.

This week, today, now would be even better.

Take action, you ignorant and lazy SOBs.

Thank you for a public comment today.

That's gonna conclude our public comment.

And now we're gonna move to the public hearing.

Council Bill 121005, an ordinance relating to land use.

Oh, I have to ask the clerk to...

I'm reading.

The clerk, I will read agenda item number one into the record.

Council Bill 121005, an ordinance relating to land use and zoning, updating and clarifying requirements for solid waste, staging areas and access for residential, commercial and industrial...

Industrial development for public hearing, briefing, discussion, possible vote.

As the presiding officer, I am now opening the public hearing on Council Bill 121005. How many speakers do we have signed up today?

We have one in-person speaker and one remote speaker.

Awesome.

Okay.

Will you please read the instructions for the public hearing?

Speakers will be called in the order of registration.

The public hearing registration will remain open until the conclusion of this public hearing.

The same public comment rules apply to this public hearing.

A 10-second chime will be your notice that it is time to wrap up comments.

Speakers' mics will be muted at the end of the allotted time.

Public comment relating to Council Bill 121005 is only being accepted at this public hearing.

Speakers are asked to begin their comments by stating their name, and each speaker will be provided two minutes.

Our in-person speaker is Alex Zimmerman.

Thank you.

Yeah, I'm ready.

My name is Alex Zimmerman.

I want to speak about zoning, land and zoning.

Guys, I come to this place for many years, speak a thousand times, and nothing changed.

Stop the time.

Mr. Zimmerman, you have to direct your comments at the public hearing that we're having for the solid waste right now.

No, it's a land use.

This is public hearing for the solid waste bill that we're doing.

No, I'm sorry.

Public hearing is here.

You told me this is number one.

You told me, yeah?

Yeah, so this about...

It's not about zoning.

Land and zoning.

It's about store waste, solid waste, staging areas, and clarifying requirements.

No, this land and zoning...

Mr. Zimmerman, you have 90 more seconds to just stay on track.

But I don't understand.

She told me this land zone.

It doesn't matter what she told me.

I'm the chair, and I'm telling you what it is about.

So I'm talking about zoning.

No, you're going to talk about solid waste.

I'm not going to listen to you about the mayor and 16 years and all that stuff.

It's not about mayor.

It's about what is he doing.

Keep his time running, please.

He's critical because he's boss number one.

So when nothing happened in Seattle, life goes worse and worse, who's responsible number one?

Mayor.

Everybody knows this.

Look, Trump.

He's not a millionaire.

He's a billionaire, but he's thinking about people.

Harrell, for 16 years I know him.

Stop time, Mr. Zimmerman.

I ask.

Stop the time.

Okay, no Harrell.

No problem.

No, there's no problem.

No problem.

Forgot about him.

Yeah, give me one minute.

I will speak.

Yeah.

So situation come right now absolutely critical, and I explain to you why.

Last week, King Country Council make a decision about refugee.

Okay, we're done.

We're stopped.

We're done.

You're all over the place.

You're not- We're done.

Cut his mic off.

You've been warned.

Mr. Zin- Please cut his mic off.

He is.

Mr. Zimmerman, you've been warned, and now I'm gonna ask you to leave.

You're not on subject.

I can stay in the guidelines.

I can listen to you say stuff, but stay in the guidelines.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Muy bien, gracias.

All right.

Do we have any more public commenters?

Our remote speakers are not present.

All right, awesome.

And anyone online?

No.

Okay, awesome.

Thank you.

So now that concludes our public hearing.

Thank you all for coming and having to navigate that with me.

There's not a member, oh, excuse me.

So now the public hearing is now closed.

Thank you and welcome guests.

And so let's please have our first presentation come up to the table.

Thank you so much.

It's always good times in chambers.

We have fun in here.

Yes, you can introduce yourself for the record and then you can begin.

Yeah, I'm Andrew Lee.

I'm the general manager CEO for Seattle Public Utilities.

Hi, I'm Angela Wallace, Development Review Supervisor and SPU Solid Waste.

Hi, Gordon Clowers, SDCI, Land Use Code Development.

Brian, good night, Council Central staff.

We're ready.

Okay, thank you so much.

Oh, we'll get a little help here with the presentation.

No worries.

I will lead off, though.

Thank you, Chair Hollingsworth and members of the committee.

Today, we're here to discuss the storage requirements for garbage, recycling, and food and yard waste containers, which do reside in the city's land use code.

These provisions exist to ensure that there is sufficient and appropriate on-site storage of garbage and recycling containers and efficient collection services for new buildings.

These requirements have not been significantly updated in more than a dozen years, and as you know, in the last 12 years, we have seen considerable change and growth in multifamily and townhome housing, and we're going to continue to see that change occurring in the city.

We are here today with legislation that would update the solid waste storage and access regulations for the city.

With me today is Angela Wallace, our Development Review Supervisor in SPU Solid Waste and Planning Program Management Division.

Gordon Clowers from SDCI's Land Use Division to brief you on the legislation.

Thank you.

Thank you everyone.

Glad to see some of you in person.

Thanks for representing us in the city.

So as Andrew stated, we seek to update this code so that we can meet a few important needs in the city.

The city is growing.

We have development patterns changing and updating this section of land use code will make sure that we can fit the containers that we need for townhomes, middle housing, multifamily housing and more and make sure that our collection vehicles can successfully get to those places.

And even perhaps more importantly in some ways, this code update is gonna provide a great deal more clarity for architects and for developers as they plan early and often for solid waste, as I like to tell them.

So we'll go through some examples today of how we're clarifying this very outdated code section.

And finally, we are proposing to implement some very important safety standards for the solid waste industry that we have had pretty good compliance with in the city, but they need to be clear for architects and developers as they plan their buildings.

So this is the Parks Public Utilities and Technology Committee, not the Land Use Committee.

So I'll just state for everyone's benefit, what is this code section?

SMC 2354040 is land use code, and my trusty land use expert here, Gordon, will be able to answer questions about that as well.

But this is the code section that says, hey, you've got solid waste needs in your property, and here's how much storage area you need, and here's how we can get to your containers.

It is governed by SDCI, Department of Construction and Inspections, but SPU Solid Waste provides meaningful and pretty extensive subject matter review of new permits for new buildings and buildings being significantly renovated so that we can make sure that all of the Proper needs are met for solid waste, including review of type 1 decisions.

So we'll talk a little bit about that, but there are opportunities to modify the code.

Those remain in this code proposal, and we are the primary guidance to SDCI on allowing those modifications to be flexible.

Okay, a couple more items about background before we dive into the content of what we're proposing.

So because this is an important land use issue, it's very important to development community and architects.

We interviewed seven Seattle-based architectural and design firms over the past couple of years.

These are large and medium developers, lots of names you've probably heard of, and we took their input and incorporated a lot of that into this code.

We also briefed the mayor's housing subcabinet, the housing...

Oh gosh, I just forgot it.

Housing workgroup, I think I just said that wrong, apologies.

Master Builders Association a couple of times, and we've also offered briefings to the other groups listed on the screen who just happened to not take us up on that offer at that time.

In addition, we published for SEPA notice in March and received no comments.

And finally, we shared a very late draft, a complete draft of this ordinance with the development community, about 25 different members from different organizations across the city, and received some questions back, and we resolved those questions with developers.

We then received their support for this ordinance, or we received sort of neutral comments, looks good, or in most cases of those 25 folks we've reached out to, just no comment.

Okay, now that we've provided you with some background, we can dive into actually the topics we are hoping to impact.

So this first category is really supporting changes in zoning and housing density in particular in Seattle.

We know that we have middle housing here now and coming more hopefully as we build the housing that we need.

And one of the important things that this code amendment will do is give us the proper Amount of space on private property to actually store the recycle container.

So you should all just think about your beloved big blue bin that's at your house that you see in this image.

The code has been incorrect for 16 years, and it has said that we only need a little two foot by six foot spot.

to put these containers.

And just bear with me, I know this is getting into the weeds, but it's a really good example of us fixing the code.

That recycled container is larger than two feet in both dimensions, so it needs two and a half feet at bare minimum to be able to say that Dense townhome development, row house, or metal housing can actually fit the cart that they need.

So we have proposed that additional six inches, we have development community support after a lot of discussion with them.

So I'm proud to bring that little fix to the code.

Secondly, we are including all zones in this code.

So previously, some residential zones and industrial zones were excluded from the code.

That makes no sense.

We should have equity across zones.

We should make sure everybody can store the solid waste carts that are required by solid waste code.

So we propose that all zones be included.

Third, I mentioned that we have added that additional six inches of space, but that does not mean there is not flexibility.

We do have flexibility.

We specifically called out in this revision of the code that dense developments like middle housing, like townhomes can choose to consolidate their solid waste storage area.

And then SPU works with them to reduce, to change up the size and the quantity of carts to get all the volume needs met, but to do so in a more efficient way.

So developers can actually now very clearly within the code request us to review a shared solid waste storage area for these dense townhome and other types of developments.

And finally, on this slide, again, really getting to the image you're seeing, this code will help us further prevent any kind of right-of-way conflicts with setting out carts in particular, and also dumpsters.

Carts are the plastic containers that you see there, and you see that they're kind of spilling over onto the sidewalk.

We don't want that.

SDOT doesn't want that.

And so this code clarifies the relationship that SPU, SCCI, and SDOT have together to review when carts need to be staged out in the right-of-way like that.

And in particular, that also protects our street trees.

We know we're going to have more street trees in public right away, and so we want to make sure that we're planning really well with those street trees, with carts, with temporary bike parking, and all the other demands on our planting strips, essentially.

Okay, final content slide.

So we are clarifying the code, and one primary way that we're doing that is actually to provide definitions.

So there were a lot of terms thrown around in this code with no definitions.

We've now provided those definitions for things like a collection area.

There's a lot of confusion on the outset for designers about what a collection location might be.

Versus a staging area.

We've clarified those.

We've also clarified when they can be the same thing, which helps folks out in their design.

So we've provided really good definitions, and those definitions also align with solid waste code.

But it's important to include them in the land use code because that's where designers go to build their buildings.

They don't go to solid waste code to build their buildings.

Secondly, I mentioned earlier we have safety parameters that we've been implementing for years and years, asking of developers for years and years, but now we've made it clear by putting them in the code.

Truck access is one, so another instance of where the code was incorrect, it said that we only needed 10 feet of width, like an approach path for a collection vehicle to come.

The trucks are over 10 feet wide with their mirrors, so we've said we need a minimum of 12 feet, which is like truly the bare minimum.

These trucks and these drivers are skilled, but they need at least 12 feet to get a vehicle through and approaching things like dumpsters.

So we proposed to fix that.

Pedestrian and driver safety.

So the big thing here was that the code was confusing about the kind of grade or slope that you could place, say, a heavy dumpster on.

We've clarified that.

Now it's crystal clear.

If it's a small two-yard dumpster, It can go on up to 6% grade.

If it's basically anything other than that, it needs to be on close to level grade.

We've given opportunity for up to 2% in the code because we know Seattle's a hilly place.

And then this picture, I think this is kind of fun.

So what it's showing you is a big roll-off dumpster.

So that's another definition that we provided in the code.

So everybody knows what that is.

And this is showing a very skilled driver Trying to service this very tall, large, heavy, compacted dumpster in just 13 feet of overhead clearance, our trucks, that truck that you're seeing there really does require 14 feet overhead minimum.

Now, this driver finds a way to do it, but it's inefficient, it takes more time, and it's not safe.

You can see the windows right above that overhead clearance banner on the roll-up door.

That's a unit.

So we want to make sure that that driver has the space they need to do this properly and not cause any kind of damage.

And they're very good.

Don't get me wrong.

They're wonderful.

But we need to give proper space for things like solid waste trucks.

Okay.

So with that, my final information for you is that not only do we have developer support, we have deep support from SDCI.

We've partnered up and down with all the right groups in SDCI, as well as Department of Transportation.

And we are proud to bring this to you today and hope we have your support.

I'm happy to answer questions now.

Thank you.

Awesome.

Thank you.

And I'd like to defer to...

Thank you for the presentation.

Defer to Brian Goodnight from Central SAF.

Thank you, Chair.

I don't actually have any comments today.

I mean, central staff has reviewed it.

I worked with our land use team to have them take a peek at it as well.

But there was no issues to bring to your concern today.

Thank you.

Awesome.

Thank you.

And then I would love to entertain any questions from colleagues.

If you have any questions, I see Councilmember Kettle.

You are first, followed by Council President Nelson.

Thank you.

Thank you, everyone, Mr. Lee.

Ms. Wallace and Mr. Clowers and of course our own Mr. Goodnight.

Thank you so much for coming and for the presentation.

I just have a few questions as we went through the briefing.

One is you mentioned the outreach and the development or the development community and to include architects and design as well.

Was there any outreach done to the residential communities to get their perspective on some of the challenges that may or, you know, exists now or, as you noted in your briefing, which is really important as we move forward with the comprehensive plan?

Yeah, no direct outreach to residential communities.

We posted the legislation on our website, SPU's front page, as a red box for a little while.

So that was there.

And we also, my boss, Christopher Ruiz, is the manager of our solid waste inspections team.

So we see firsthand, everyday comments from customers about what they need.

And I think all the fixes that we've proposed will Benefit residents as well as the city, as well as our collection contractors and developers up front as they build.

But no, no direct outreach to actual residents.

Okay, the complaints and so forth probably is a different way of tackling that.

I was going to offer, I have my District 7 neighborhood council, which is a council of councils with a great amount of outreach.

So if you did want, because they're very quick to provide input on a whole host of issues, and if we were to go out to them on a question related to this, I'm sure you'll get some Interesting feedback.

If you need it in addition to the various issues that were brought up during the course of regular service, I'll be there.

I mentioned the comm plan.

I've been thinking about this independent of this briefing as part of the comprehensive plan.

There will be an amendment to the comprehensive plan called public safety element.

And one of the parts of that is, in addition to growing our public safety element, you know, the fire department, police department, as we grow as a city, another piece, particularly for fire with ladder trucks and fire engines, is the ability to maneuver in our city in these tight streets and the alleys.

And in these conversations, I've often brought up, because I see a garbage truck, I see a compost truck, and a recycling truck come into the neighborhood.

And those vehicles, as you noted, need space.

And do you find that our alleys are sufficient And the second part of the question is, and I've talked about as part of the comprehensive plan of having like side yards, adjustments, flexibility in terms of the setbacks for the comprehensive plan.

And I've mentioned the backyard only as it relates to not crowding the alley, so therefore not crowding the SPU's trucks and, oh, by the way, fire engines and ladder trucks.

Is that something that you've looked at?

Is that something you've had conversations with OPCD or other organizations in the city?

Generally, the alleys are sufficient in the city.

There are many examples of troublesome alleys as well.

Alley width is not typically the challenge.

If a fire truck can get through, we can get through, so that's great.

We like that.

SPU would happily support, I would say, or partner or entertain, let's say entertain, since my general manager is sitting here, the idea of alleys being better maintained in the city.

Better maintain, to include trees, bushes, and...

Better maintain to allow access and to be paved or asphalt.

Paved, okay.

Yeah.

Because some are not, okay.

Correct.

I will admit, I annually prune our lilac so it doesn't impact the drivers.

Thank you.

My boss's team will send you a trim your alley trees letter if you don't.

I've gotten them in the past.

One or two.

Only one or two, and that's it.

Councilmember, if I may add, allies do pose an issue for us.

I'm looking at Councilmember Rivera because of the U District is, you know, primary on our list, but for a whole host of reasons.

But from an access perspective, we generally try to find a way to make it work if there are access restrictions.

So we have things called stinger services where we The collection company will actually have a smaller vehicle that will go and collect and bring it to the larger vehicle, in a sense, or directly to the transfer station.

That is not our preference because...

It's not efficient.

It's not efficient, exactly, right?

And so having standards is really, really helpful.

This legislation, unfortunately, doesn't deal with that.

It primarily deals with on the site, like in terms of the actual building, the access, the entry points.

But it is something that we are constantly mindful of.

Well, you know, by the way, not only is Chair Hollingsworth the chair of this committee, she's also the chair of the Special Select Committee on the Comprehensive Plan.

So if there's opportunities to, and my office would be more than happy to hear from you regarding, hey, if there is anything to ensure that we have a, it's all about having a functional city government, functional city, and what I don't want to have happen, and I'd usually come at this from a public safety perspective, but I also know that's an issue potentially for SPU.

is the ability for their trucks to get in.

And this also includes, you know, the slope piece, and that's really important.

And I will add, I'm on the last high ground where I live, and I see the trucks navigate the slope to my west and how they back in.

I mean, it is a feat of extreme skill for them to get these trucks back into what is, in my case, a dead-end alley.

And so I want to commend them, whoever may be here, for that too.

And the slopes piece is very important.

And that needs to be addressed.

And my last question is, we passed a bill earlier this year.

And so in some ways, this question is too late.

I put an amendment in related to design review holiday for downtown.

And I wanted to bring up downtown because downtown is very different from The residential areas, you know, we're a regional center here.

We have three regional centers plus four, if you can count over to D3.

And so it's very different there compared to neighborhood areas like Queen Anne and Magnolia and other parts of the city.

So we have this design review holiday for downtown.

And in there had an amendment that pulled out loading docks because we have to ensure that the loading docks are to code and done very right for commercial and residential loading docks.

And so I see your slide and then I'm wondering You know, there's a code account to ensure that they have 14 feet of clearance versus 13 feet of clearance, and I can't answer that question.

Is this a concern for you in terms of not thinking about the residential areas, but for the residential areas of downtown, Uptown, South Lake Union, Belltown, Cap Hill maybe?

How does that play in your ability to do?

And maybe this is something that we could do with a comprehensive plan.

Yeah, just I should have clarified when I said this option of a overhead clearance for a solid waste dumpster is purely an option for developers if they choose this style of service where we back into the property.

So if they were to choose that, then our solid waste access would need that minimum 14 overhead clear.

With regard to zoning and loading dock requirements, I'd have to defer to SDCI.

Yeah well I think the main point would be that there's loading dock area requirements and then solid waste area requirements separately so both would need to be fulfilled and I take your point about specifications but they would probably go with the higher ceiling height for the combo of loading and waste that would be preferred.

I bring this up because, you know, a lot of this, the focus is the residential areas and so forth.

And even with the middle housing, that is in certain, you know, basically the neighborhood residential areas.

But we have a lot of residents now in a straight-up urban environment, whether it's downtown, Belltown, Uptown, South Lake Union, and so forth.

And we need to ensure And because of things that happen today, we have to live with the consequences for decades, the life cycle of that building.

And this is why I brought in the loading dock amendment for the design review holiday, because we would have to live with that.

If the developers wanted to go a little bit, I don't want to use the word cheap, but simple or not account for that, we would, as a city, would be living with that, because that logistics would be thrown onto the street.

And then your SDOC colleague would be, Director Emery, would be like, hey, what's happening here?

And I see the similar things here, like, you know, the example of this picture.

I noted your update on it, but still for SDCI.

I think this is something that we need to mentally be thinking of in the urban center in a way that we didn't think about 20, 30 years ago, because we have so many residents here now that we didn't have earlier generation.

So thank you.

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Councilmember Kettle.

Council President Nelson, followed by Councilmember Rivera.

Thank you very much.

My ears picked up when you noted your presenters and how many years it's been since revision of the codes around solid waste.

Did you say 25?

I can't remember.

About 16. Well, that just brought to mind a little walk down memory lane because it was my old boss, Richard Conlon, who is the person who basically put in place the first mandatory rules about composting and recycling.

So I know that any revision is difficult because Garbage touches everybody.

I mean, and the end users are so varied.

You have residents of multifamily, you have trash haulers that are hauling things not that are picked up on the curbside.

Then you have our regular contracted So I just have to hand it to you that this is a hard process and it takes a lot of work to update and get it right.

So thank you very much for that.

I mean, that was a whole revision of the Solid Waste Master Plan way back when.

But it's really important to update it because as you're right, the population of the city is growing.

So what I wanted to know, my question is about that one of those last photos that you showed with the The small opening to get out that big compressor.

And I think that you said that ideal would be 14 feet high and what we were seeing was only 13 feet.

I could be wrong.

But does that mean that the garage doors have to be able to open 14 feet?

Or is that a minimum roof height to be able to tilt up the The compressor, can you explain more about that?

Because I'm sure that whenever you talk about taking feet away from living space, then that does produce some discussion amongst perhaps architects, developers, etc.

Sure.

Thank you for the question, Council President.

So this is, again, an optional style of service for large multifamily or mixed-use buildings.

This is not an SPU or SDCI mandate.

If they chose for their building that they needed to do compacted solid waste because it's 200 units and it's so much solid waste, they'd save $30,000 a year.

and solid waste costs, and they went for this dumpster, then yes, they need to provide 14 feet overhead clear inside the building, so not just the entry place for the truck, but also in the picture you see here, the insulation.

There could be no pipes hanging down, no fire sprinklers down below 14 feet.

Does that answer the question?

Yeah, so is that, Would that be easy for a lot of existing buildings to implement or would this be required going forward and then a developer could decide when or an architect when designing the building that that would be a service that would make sense and so therefore need some extra hype?

The code applies only to new construction or substantially changed buildings, changes in use over 10,000 square feet.

So this is not retroactive to any building in the city unless they're doing a massive change of use.

Yeah, because have you move a ceiling unless there are some things above that can be moved.

And it's very much a choice and it's only chosen by a select few, medium, large, extra large buildings, towers, et cetera.

Got it.

Thank you.

Awesome.

Thank you, Council President Nelson.

Councilmember Rivera.

Thank you, Chair, and thank you all for being here.

Just to underscore the importance of our cities growing, and so we need to update and make changes to the code as we're adding density in buildings to the city.

And I appreciate Councilmember Kettle.

I had the same ideas about the comp plan and ensuring right hand, left hand that the sister city departments that also touch upon solid waste like fire who have to deal with dumpster fires, literal dumpster fires.

And making sure we are all aligned as we're moving forward.

And then General Manager Lee beat me to the punch on, I know we're not talking about issues related to the actual dumpsters that are currently situated there, and we're certainly adding to it, but just ensuring that we are also giving attention to dealing with the impacts of these dumpsters, people adding trash to it.

are causing in some instances, dumpster fires that are really problematic in all the districts across the city.

So making sure that we are also looking at that and finding ways to mitigate for that because it is a huge problem in the U District and I suspect not just in the U District.

So making sure that we are also giving attention to that and what we're gonna do about that.

Thank you, Chair.

Awesome.

Thank you, Council Member Rivera.

I don't know if there's any other comments.

Council Member Strauss?

May I, Chair?

Absolutely.

Thank you, friends.

If we were planning to vote on this today, I'm just going to abstain because we haven't had a time to get into a lot of these details.

Everyone's busy.

There's no problems here.

I just need to go a little bit deeper than we have time for in committee today.

I'm going to start.

Okay, I see we're not voting today, so it sounds like we'll get another opportunity.

Just to do some level setting here, this bill would now apply to neighborhood residential, low-rise, neighborhood commercial, and multifamily.

Is that correct?

I believe it already applied to all those zones.

Except for NR.

Except for NR.

Thank you.

So colleagues, land use zone here, this bill has already been in practice in low rise, so townhomes, et cetera, and in multifamily high rise, the neighborhood commercial on up.

The largest part of this is that we are expanding it.

And again, friends, this is my first time hearing this presentation.

So we're just diving in.

Tell me if I'm wrong on any of this.

We're now going into neighborhood residential, in part, I'm assuming because of 1110, where we'll have multifamily units or multiple units on what has traditionally just been a single lot, where we are now needing to apply some of these similar standards that we have seen in low rise that will soon be experienced in neighborhood residential.

Am I picking up on these factors correctly?

Thank you.

Folks, now I'm gonna talk about the tree ordinance.

Didn't expect to go there today, did we?

So one of the hard parts about the tree ordinance is that the city puts a lot of requirements on what goes into a low rise zone.

And so during the tree ordinance, an issue came up about how much coverage could a building have In low-rise, we were not talking about single-family.

Single-family still has a 35% lot coverage.

We'll bring that up in the comp plan.

We'll bring that up in another place.

One of the reasons why 85% lot coverage was chosen for low rise and low rise only neighborhood commercial and up is 100% lot coverage because again, you can put trees on roofs.

You're not going to build a six story building and carve out a corner, right?

Like these are some of these trade offs that we make with density.

One of the challenges is that beyond just trash, we also require common areas, walkways.

Gordon, you want to remind me of what the other amenity areas?

I believe in some cases we even require bike storage.

I think we also require planting of shrubs and bushes.

What other amenities do we require?

Well, I think that you've covered the main ones there.

Amenity area is sort of a recreational outdoor space for For units, yes.

For low rise.

So before the tree ordinance, people could be required to cut down a tree because they were required to plant a bush.

I'm not kidding you.

We have made changes through that 2023 tree ordinance that allows for retaining a tree to count towards their landscaping goal, for instance, which was important.

One of the hard parts was trash.

Funnily enough, because we are requiring the builder to set aside an amount of space for trash and that can cause friction with having to cut down a tree because we don't have enough space on the lot.

During the tree ordinance, We lowered, we provided flexibility in amenity areas, so with setbacks, with trash, bike, walking.

We fixed the trees getting cut down for bushes issue.

We allowed for flexibility, I believe up to 50%.

Again, this is all off the top of my head, so don't quote me on some of these numbers.

We probably should have allowed for 100% flexibility there.

Because we probably, we need to give builders more flexibility to save these trees.

But I just, this is an example of, we take this as a one-off issue.

And there are many other things that the city is requiring of builders that add up to 85% lot coverage in low rise, 100% lot coverage in neighborhood commercial on up.

And so I just want to flag that for everyone.

Requiring the space might be important to do so in a certain way.

Actually, it is important to do so in a certain way.

It troubles me that we would require cutting down a tree to set the trash cans in a certain way.

So that's my overarching edit.

And we can dig into what some of these solutions might be, and it might not be in this code, it might be in the code that governs Trees and those land use aspects otherwise.

But I do think that it is important that we right size how much space we're requesting because, like you said, the recycled bins are more than two feet by two feet in either direction.

And so if we're requiring only two feet to be set aside, we're not doing it right.

I just wanted to flag this, colleagues, that they're...

That we are compounding issues here and that changes might need to be made at a more broad scale to protect trees.

May I respond with some benefits that might help your thinking or fill out some of what your concerns are, what we've done in this code.

So first of all, there's always flexibility.

There's a type one decision that is available in the current code version and is and remains available in our proposed changes to this.

Second of all, SPU plants a great deal of the trees in the city in the right-of-way, and our solid waste team always puts trees first.

This is the first I've ever heard of a tree and solid waste space coming into conflict in that way.

I've never heard that, and it saddens me if that's the case.

My team leads review, and we always defer to Estar Urban Forestry And we always make sure trees come first.

We will find a way to handle solid waste.

One of the additional things that we can do to reduce the space required on private property is something called hybrid service, which is a service me and a colleague literally made up six years ago in response to townhome development, where we have, say, eight townhomes share the recycling carts.

So instead of having eight of them taking up all that much more space on a property, they have four.

And we service that every other week under a multi-family style service.

So we will come out and we will get those containers every week instead of every two weeks.

So that is a super important way that we can partner with developers right up front to make sure that we are not losing trees and hopefully not losing any kind of amenity space.

We know that amenity space is viewed as sacred in many circles and Gosh, I just don't see that becoming a problem going forward with this amendment to the code or our practices as a utility with regard to trees.

I'll add that definitely this flexibility provision that we are Putting a little more detail into with the intent to have the flexibility apply where it needs to apply, make it more clear that way.

And that I should acknowledge that you have a very relevant comment that especially in our zones about the amount of space and the requirements and allocations and the new We tried to account for that with some really, really fine-grained discussion in SCCI and about more of the requirements up front for space and the ability to share storage areas in unit lot subdivisions, for example, putting more specifics into that so that alternate arrangements are possible to make it all work.

As dense as we're gonna get, it may be a challenge still for designers, but that we are really trying to build out those details.

Thank you.

Just the hybrid service, thank you very much for making that happen because that is something that is actual that we can do today to reduce this footprint.

The reason that you've probably never heard of the trash zone being the final thing is because I'm trying to paint this picture for all of us here, which is that it is the trash and recycle plus the walkways plus the common space.

Plus then the building footprint.

And that's what adds up to a hardscape that is, it feels like it's too much, but when you start adding up all of the city requirements, it becomes 85%.

I do just want to sit in on type one decisions though.

Generally, how much time does that, and if these are questions you need to come back to me with, type one decisions, I absolutely hear it.

It adds time and cost to projects.

We are well within SDCI permit timelines.

We, as Solid Waste is perhaps one time in the seven years I've been running this program, been any sort of delay on a permit.

So we come so early and so we are so early on in the permit review that they are done with us way before they go on to even correction cycle two.

So we do not, in my opinion, delay at all a development timeline or design timeline.

Our code being clear and our guidance on our website and the free advice we give to developers makes it real easy to get your solid waste dialed in quickly.

It does not delay permitting.

Let me restate that then.

It adds time.

Overall, the code will reduce their time because now it's clear.

Before, they had to ask us so many questions.

What does this mean?

Why is it 6%?

Why is it 2%?

Can my commercial and my residential share a solid waste room?

Which now we've clarified it because it was super confusing.

It is super confusing in the current version.

So we hope that we're actually reducing the amount of confusion and time early on.

But again, we are not the hang-up in a permitting cycle.

Yes, I am giving you that credit.

You're not the hang-up, you're getting it done quick.

I am just saying that if the pathway for relief is a Type 1 decision, then a Type 1 decision takes more time than just going and having it clear in code.

Well, I can clarify that for you.

In any given development permit review, we may give the SDCI director discretion to grant some flexibility within the context of the single permit decision to waive or adjust requirements through the type 1 decision.

So a type 1 is just rolled into the full permit review of the project.

So it's not necessarily any wasted time.

But it's added time.

I wouldn't say necessarily.

Let's take this offline.

Y'all are doing great work.

This is a good bill.

Let me dig into it more deeply with you.

But this is the conversation that we're having in this city, is how much time does it take to build the housing that we are already undersupplied, and whether it's a definitional delay within our permit timelines, which I don't, again, Don't believe that we're hitting our permit timelines in the way that I think that we should.

That's a personal opinion, professional opinion over here.

All that to say, the more time we are adding into these construction schedules, the harder it becomes to create and provide the housing that we're so undersupplied with.

That's a personal statement over here.

I just want to thank you all for making the code more clean and looking forward to digging into this more deeply with you.

Awesome.

Thank you, Councilmember Strauss.

Sorry, I thought Council Member Rivera had a comment.

My apologies.

You did?

No.

Okay, awesome.

Thank you all for clarifying that.

I know we'll do more of a deep dive and looking forward to that report, Council Member Schaus, where you said we could have taken down trees to replace for a bush.

We changed that already.

So if you preserve a tree today, it counts towards your landscaping factor, which was not the case in 2022.

Understood.

Okay, got you.

Thank you for clarifying that.

I was like, that would be very...

That was stupid.

That was very, yes.

You said it, not me.

I'm just concurring with you.

Yes.

So thank you all.

I know we'll have you back and I know council members will follow up just to get more information and clarity and do a deeper dive.

But thank you all for putting this forward.

I think it's really important that you all have this, especially as we're navigating the comprehensive plan.

It's really interesting.

A lot of people don't, Realize how the infrastructure needs to come along as we're building stuff.

I had an opportunity to visit all the fire departments in our district and I asked the Capitol Hill fire department what has changed and what was different and one of the things they had talked about was the width of their ladders had to get skinnier because buildings are a little bit different and so they had to order new ladders and not the big heavy ones that they used to have.

And so they can be nimble through buildings.

And I thought that was really interesting to hear because of the architecture and the infrastructure has changed significantly in Seattle.

And so I see this along the lines as we're kind of changing with the times and trying to figure out better ways to accommodate more people, be more efficient, still being able to move around the city, and then also for the drivers to be safe as well while they're picking up trash and stuff.

So thank you all for this.

Thank you.

Awesome.

Okay, with that being said, we are ready for agenda item number two.

Oh, Clerk, will you please read it?

I'm sorry.

Agenda Item 2, Council Bill 121036, an ordinance relating to Seattle Parks and Recreation, authorizing the superintendent to execute a concession agreement granting the Kite Cafe LLC the right to exclusive use and occupancy of the Golden Gardens bathroom concession premises.

This is for briefing discussion and possible vote.

And I didn't say my Seattle Public Utilities joke.

Before y'all leave, and you guys can hear it out there, you want to hear my joke?

Why did the faucet break up with the sink?

because they felt the relationship was going down the drain.

That's really good, huh?

That was good.

Stay here all day.

She's got more.

I got you.

I got more.

I got more.

Wasn't that good?

It was good.

Thank you.

That was a good faucet and a sink in a relationship, and they broke up because it was going down the drain.

All right.

We are ready for our parks department.

I got a parks joke, too.

It's coming after the presentation.

All right.

After you all.

Okay.

Well, maybe I'll start out with...

And we'll go down the line.

I'm Christopher Williams, Chief of Staff, Seattle Parks and Recreation.

I'm Kathleen Gantz, the Contracts Manager for Seattle Parks and Recreation.

Kathleen Gantz, Contracts Manager for Seattle Parks and Recreation.

I'm Joanne Gunter, Parks Concession Coordinator for Seattle Parks and Recreation.

I'm Tony Meyer.

I'm with the Kite Cafe.

I'm Matt Kelly with the Kite Cafe.

Great.

Start off here.

Thank you for giving us the opportunity to make this presentation today.

I'm joined here by two very capable Seattle Park and Recreation staff that you just met, Joanne Gunther and Kathleen Gantz.

We're also joined by Matt Kelly and Tony Meyer.

They operate the concession at Golden Gardens, and I had a chance to meet them in the hallway as we were waiting to come up here, and I was impressed by their energy, their enthusiasm.

I hear that Tony makes a great Subway sandwich, so if you're in the vicinity of Golden Gardens, stop by and take that in.

One of the things I want to say about concessions in general, you heard about our golf concession Not too long ago, we brought that contract here.

That's on one end of the spectrum where we engage a contractor to operate huge golf complexes, some 596 acres of golf courses across the city.

At the other end of that spectrum, We contract with vendors to operate ice cream trucks in our parks and somewhere in between we contract with folks like Matthew and Tony to operate the concession at Golden Gardens Park.

The concession has broad benefits.

It is kind of the Park Department's economic development journey.

We have Small places across the city that we engage private contractors and concession contracts.

This provides an economic development opportunity.

It provides eyes on the park and it provides a direct benefit to public park and recreation users.

So they're not just in business.

But they are actively engaging in stewardship by operating the concession at Golden Gardens Park.

So with that, I will turn it over to Kathleen or Joanne.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you, Christopher, for your kind introduction.

And thank you, Councilmember Strauss, Rivera, Hollingsworth, and Kettle for your time and attention today.

We are here today for consideration of an ordinance authorizing the park superintendent to execute a long-term food concession agreement with the Kite Cafe.

This grants the Kite Cafe exclusive use and occupancy of the concession premises at Golden Gardens Bath House.

The Golden Gardens bathhouse is located in northwest Seattle, directly facing the Sound in the Ballard neighborhood.

We will be discussing the food concessions, which is located at the south end of the bathhouse, as seen in the picture from the shore.

We're going to highlight today the agreement goals, the background information, timeline, key terms of the agreement, and address any questions you may have afterwards.

We have some long-term agreement goals.

Our shared long-term goals include positive activation of the historic Golden Gardens building and the park, enhancing the Golden Gardens experience by providing high-quality, affordable, healthy food options using local producers where possible, generating revenues to support SPR's operations, thus enabling a small business to succeed.

There's also a great benefit in providing eyes on the park and building to enhance safety and a welcoming feeling.

And lastly, participation in beach cleanup is always good for all of us.

We want to highlight a few historical events at Golden Gardens Park.

In 1923, the City of Seattle purchased 52 acres of land for $37,000 and established Golden Gardens Park.

In July of 1929, a bathhouse was constructed by the Parks Department, and it opened to support saltwater swimming.

From the late 20s through the 60s, numerous improvements and changes were made to the facility, including the addition of an open-air concession stand in the 1950s.

In 1974, sadly, the bathhouse was closed for over two decades.

And then the 2000 Parks Levy allowed for renovations.

And as a result, the building was repurposed as an affordable, waterfront, revenue-generating special events venue hosting weddings, memorials, and office gatherings.

And in 2004, renovations were made to the concession space.

And finally, in 2006, we had our first long-term food concessionaire selected through A formal request for proposals, RFP, process, and another was done in 2016. In the fall of 2023, Seattle Parks and Recreation facilitated another formal public process to solicit proposals through an RFP.

We received four proposals that were scored and interviewed by three SPR staff and three community members.

On January 31st, 2024, the selected vendor, the Kite Cafe, was awarded a short-term contract to ensure that food concessions and operations continued at Golden Gardens while we negotiated a long-term contract.

In the spring of 2024, mid-May, the Kite Cafe opened under a one-year agreement.

Tenant improvements included new paint, electrical upgrades, as well as permanent shelving.

In 2024, the net revenue received was $38,300.

We are here now in the summer of 2025 for Council's consideration of a long-term agreement.

The premises consist of 480 square feet of cafe space and a 20 square foot storage closet.

Regarding the vehicles, the ice cream Jeep must remain on premises and fully under the awning during business hours and is permitted use from Thursdays through Sundays.

The Kite Cafe was awarded an initial five-year term with the option of a five-year extension with mutual agreement.

They pay the full fair market value in cash, totaling $16,300 annually, which is paid in monthly installments.

They will have a CPI increase of no more than 4 percent annually.

The initial five-year term concession fee will total $81,500 plus CPI, with the five-year extension having the same terms.

Additionally, they will pay a 1% concession fee of sales over $1 million, and they have not yet reached this threshold.

Regarding the utilities, the Kite Cafe has separate meters for electricity, which they pay.

They also will pay a proportionate share of the shared gas meter.

SPR builds for that once a year.

The previous vendor paid about $100 annually for that gas.

The water and sewers paid for by SPR as the restrooms are not part of their premise.

And SPR also is responsible for the building envelope and the systems.

I just wanted to mention that the $16,300, it's not a giveaway.

As this is largely a seasonal business and we require them to be here year-round, we know that they operate at a loss during the winter months.

We mentioned earlier that they paid $38,300 last year.

This interim agreement assumed a minimum fair market value rent or 15 percent receipts.

That model was subsequently deemed unsustainable.

Therefore, the proposed legislation has a fair market value flat fee rate, and SPR has already approved the change from a high percentage of sales to the fair market value going forward in this long-term agreement.

Our shared goals that we mentioned earlier demonstrate some of the intangible benefits that come with a year-round concessionaire who keeps eyes on the park.

At the Kite Cafe, they are proud to support and collaborate with local farms and small businesses right here in the Seattle area.

The Kite Cafe supports locally grown food from producers and offers a diverse menu with cost-conscious, local, and healthy food options.

This past season, they partnered with incredible growers like Hayton Farms, Collins Family Orchards, and many others.

The Kite Cafe also proudly serves Seattle Pops.

It's a women-owned and operated popsicle company based in North Seattle, crafting all-natural, hyper-local, organic popsicles perfect for every season.

The Kite Cafe is also honored to be an authorized retailer of Prism Kite Technology, a Seattle-based kite designer and manufacturer located in Fisherman's Terminal.

And of course, they love giving back to the community by sponsoring a local Little League team.

Cold hand-spun peach milkshakes on a hot July day by the Salish Sea?

Count me in.

That sounds absolutely delightful.

The ice cream Jeep vibe really adds a fun nostalgic touch to the Kite Cafe experience.

And I just want to say Tony and Matt have been such a wonderful, reliable, and friendly partners throughout their contract, being timely with paperwork, being a partner in the care and the maintenance and upkeep of this beautiful building in the city, and they continue to support the mission and values of Seattle Parks and Recreation in their offerings to the community.

They embrace many of SPR's values of creating warm and welcoming spaces, creating community, and providing jobs and training opportunities for youth.

That's the kind of collaboration everyone appreciates.

Are you thinking visiting soon or maybe sharing this with your team?

They are open seven days a week during high season, so come on down and have a sandwich and a shake.

And now I'd like to open the floor to anyone who has questions or concerns for any of us.

Well, thank you.

That was a great presentation and made me super...

It all sounded great.

I don't know if from Kite Cafe, if you all had anything to add, and then I'm going to defer to the council members whose district this is in for first comments.

But do you all have anything to add?

Yeah, sure.

I just would say that it's been a real pleasure being at Golden Gardens this last year, and we've really enjoyed working with the parks team.

They've been really supportive in helping us get open, and we're excited to continue to serve the beach.

Awesome, thank you.

And colleagues, this will be the moment for questions.

I'm gonna defer to Council Member Strauss.

Thank you, Chair Hollingsworth, and thank you to the parks team for putting this concessionaire agreement together.

Matt and Tony, thank you for making and creating an open space there that people can get to, because Golden Gardens Park is different than, and especially this Kite Cafe, is different than pretty much any other facility that we have in our park system.

Christopher Williams said it well.

The golf courses are 596 acres.

And this space is less than 596 square feet.

Right.

I mean, just to put that in perspective, to give everyone some reference points, to the north of the bathhouse is Meadow Point, which is the Coast Guard's designation for that point.

And to the south is Shilshul Bay between Golden Gardens and Discovery Park.

And Chair, we did receive a report today that the seagulls have stopped flying over the bay.

Do you know why?

Why?

They would be bagels.

Bad jokes.

Hers was funnier.

But in all seriousness, this location has been hard.

And this location has been hard because in the summertime, business is booming all four days of summer.

And then in the rest of the year, it's one of the most uncomfortable places to be in the city.

The reason that I choose to go to the Elks Beach instead of Golden Gardens is because there's no wind at the Elks Beach.

It's within a mile of each other.

The wind factor, the rain factor, the dreariness factor, it is all so difficult For the bathhouse and for the cafe space that I have watched businesses last about three and a half years.

And so it's been these five-year contracts that we don't even get to the end of the contract.

So colleagues, I have requested some amendments to this contract.

I will continue working with law and I know that this is the second time in a row that I've brought an amendment to a contract.

I'm letting everyone know and I'm stating on the record, especially for our law office, this is the last time I'll bring amendments to a contract.

From here on out, I will either just reject them or send them back.

I'm serious, because I'm not here to get in the middle of your relationship with your concessionaires, but I'm also here as not a rubber stamp.

I'm here to make sure that it's a final check before An agreement becomes an ordinance, right?

And so, colleagues, to give you a flavor of just some of these amendments and what I've shared, I'll share it with everyone right now, if these are not welcome, I'm not gonna do them.

Right?

Like, we're all in this together.

I want you all to be in control of your own destiny as a business.

I also note that because businesses have had a record of, like, a record every time of failing in three and a half years for the past, I think, three or four cycles, that this is not, like, there's precedent as to why some of these changes need to be made.

But just looking at the cost, I think that the cost in the contract before us is higher than the RFP.

Looking at that, the Jeep requiring it to stay under the awning.

The awning is a public benefit of shade.

The Jeep could get parked on the side of the building.

I mean, these are some of these small, small issues of requiring, allowing for flexibility and not putting additional requirements on Matt and Tony, right?

Because it is...

When the room was more full, I was going to take a poll of how many people have been to Golden Gardens, how many people have been to Golden Gardens in the summer, how many people have been to Golden Gardens in the winter and everyone's hand goes down, right?

And we're requiring them to be open in the winter.

And that's something that I think that we all need to be aware of because if they're providing a This is a public-private partnership in the sense that the public is getting a benefit of not being stranded on a cold, rainy beach because there's the Kite Cafe to keep them warm for a couple minutes.

But if we're not setting them up for success, then we're doing ourselves harm.

That's generally, I mean, we could walk through some of this.

I will also make a commitment to the Parks Department and to the team and to chair.

I'll have all of this done by the next committee to get voted out at the next committee so that we're not getting delayed into budget or into December.

I want to keep us on this path.

I mean, that's what I got.

Thank you, Councilmember Strauss.

Thank you for that.

And I know that obviously this will come to the next meeting, so we'll be able to address those amendments and work on them.

You will work on them, essential staff and you, and we'll be able to hear those out.

You said you wanted to share them or no?

I mean, I started kind of ticking through them.

I think it would be helpful to have Law review them.

I see Karina in the audience, and we were actually going over these amendments, and that's part of why I was late to committee today.

I would love to have an opportunity to share them with Parks and with Kite Cafe ahead of presenting them at committee to make sure that we're all on the same page.

Again, everyone has veto power.

But I just see this as being so different than all other agreements that we have in the city because there's no other location that is this geographically isolated, this environmentally isolated.

And also I'd love to explore how can the Kite Cafe better partner with the rest of the bathhouse, which is a rental facility, right?

I see the catering trucks come in all the time.

I'll kind of leave it there before I open Pandora's box again.

And then I just also point a personal privilege Matt and Tony, you do incredible civic work through your private company with the Queen Anne Farmers Market D7, Bob Kettle, and then with the services that you provide, Salmon Bay FC and Ballard FC.

As I think you may know, I'm not going to be able to be at the playoff game on Friday, so please shout for me.

Those are my personal privileges today, Chair.

And we can coordinate because I know your time is precious.

If we all come to agreement and you don't feel like you need to come back to committee, I'm happy to carry your water.

But also if you want to be here at committee, I just want to respect your time as well.

Awesome.

Thank you, Councilmember Strauss.

Are there any other comments, Councilmember Kettle, Council President Nelson, or Councilmember Rivera?

Well, thank you all.

Looking forward to this.

I was actually online looking at your menu.

Number one, I think it's phenomenal that your reviews are 4.8.

That's like super high, especially in restaurants.

So I thought that was really cool to go down the line and look at all the great comments that people had for you all.

And then I am going to get the Greenwood sandwich, because that's vegan.

There's nothing better than a good, nice hoagie sandwich.

And I need oil and vinegar on it.

Okay, with a little pepper.

You got me?

Okay.

I am coming there.

Okay.

And yes, I have been to Golden Gardens in the winter, Councilmember Strauss.

How was it?

It was not, you know, it's not like the summer.

So I have been there.

It's not like the summer.

And I can't remember, there is a dog park that's...

There is.

Yeah.

Which is more protected from the wind than the beach.

It is.

I've never gotten cold there with my dog, Santana.

So that's been cool.

All right.

Awesome.

Thank you all for being here.

Really appreciate it.

And I don't know if there's any last comments at all, Mr. Williams.

Thank you.

Awesome.

Appreciate the time.

Easy.

Yeah.

All right.

Awesome.

So thank you all for being here.

We'll see you back next committee.

Thank you.

And colleagues, just a heads up, our...

Oh, here's the dad joke, okay?

Or dad joke, dad park joke, okay?

Why does not Councilmember Strauss get lost in a park?

Because the Friends of Discovery Park made a map.

No, because you leave leaves a bunch of bad dad jokes behind.

Okay, that's anyways, whatever.

Item number three into the agenda.

I thought that was good.

Friends of Discovery Park does make a good map though.

Okay.

Agenda item three is Council Bill 121038, an ordinance relating to Seattle Parks and Recreation authorizing the superintendent to enter into a five-year agreement with options to extend with lost evenings to operate and provide management of the Green Lake Pigeon Putt at Green Lake Park.

Awesome.

Please introduce yourself for the record.

I was literally, I thought that was the end of our meeting, and so I was going to close the meeting, but I forgot we had agenda item number three.

Thank you all.

I apologize.

Please jump into your presentation.

You bet.

So Christopher Williams, again, joined by Kathleen Gantz and Amy Faulkner from Lost Evenings, who is the business owner, had planned to join us virtually.

I don't know if she's online.

We will double check.

Awesome.

Well, we can still move forward.

So the Green Lake Pitch and Putt is a cherished 70-year-old facility.

Lots of history there.

I've been in the neighborhood for a long time.

A lot of young people developed their interest in golf by playing and practicing at the Pitch and Putt.

We've had one operator for like the past 14 or 15 years.

We recently went through an RFP process.

And Amy and Lost Evenings were the successful awardee.

Amy brings lots of energy.

And new ideas to the pitch and putt.

And as you drive by, you'll see lots of little changes that are kind of an invitation to the public to come in and see what's happening.

We're excited to be partnering with Amy and Lost Evenings on the pitch and putt.

And right now, I'll ask Kathleen to talk you through the significant elements of this agreement.

Thank you, Christopher.

And thank you all for being here today to talk about the Green Lake Pitch and Putt and our proposed concessions agreement with Lost Evenings LLC for the management and operation of this site.

As Christopher said, Pitch and Putt is a shorter, less formal version of golf where the course has shorter holes and takes only about an hour or two to complete a round.

So this presentation, we're gonna cover four key areas, the background on the Green Lake Pitch and Putt, the request for proposal or RFP process, our key conditions of the proposed agreement, and the community support and programming plans.

The purpose of this agreement is the consideration of an ordinance authorizing the superintendent to enter into a five-year contract with options to extend with lost evenings to activate and maintain this beloved community asset.

Our goals for this long-term agreement are as follows.

Okay, correct screen.

Sorry about that.

First, we want to sustain the seasonal activation of the Pitch and Putt, which provides a vibrant recreational option at Green Lake.

Second, we want to have a consistent operator providing eyes on the park, supporting both safety and stewardship.

Third, we're excited to work with an operator who brings such enthusiasm, vision, and a commitment to inclusion and community engagement.

And finally, this agreement helps us generate revenue to support operations and tackle long overdue facility improvements.

This course has deep roots in the community.

It was developed in 1947, and the original building dates back to 1948. Since 1953, the city has owned the course, and for over 40 years, a single family operated the concession until the most recent contract expired in November of 2024. It has long served as an accessible entry point to golf and continues to be cherished by locals.

Here's a quick timeline of our recent developments.

In the spring of 2024, we initiated a competitive RFP process, receiving six proposals.

We had a very diverse panel consisting of different races and genders, with ages ranging from a high school student to a senior couple, two City of Seattle staff members, and four community representatives, one of whom is a golf professional.

With their combined scoring, they selected Gilly Wagon, now operating as Lost Evenings.

In the winter of 2024 and 2025, we did site upgrades during the regular seasonal closure.

And Lost Evenings began operating this spring, and we're now bringing forward this long-term agreement for council consideration.

So the key terms of the proposed agreement are, this agreement covers the nine-hole par-three course at the park's south end.

Each hole is designed to be completed in three strokes by a skilled player.

The season runs from March through October.

It includes initial five-year term with two optional five-year extensions.

The concessionaire will pay 10% of revenue monthly with a guaranteed minimum of $26,000 annually, plus an additional $300 in utilities monthly.

Events are allowed with SPR's approval, with 10% of event revenue going to SPR.

Lost Evenings is responsible for the day-to-day maintenance, while SPR handles major maintenance.

And by year three, the operator will install or upgrade the restroom to meet our ADA standards.

We're particularly excited about Lost Evening's proposed community programming, which expands beyond traditional golf offerings.

Some examples include kids' golf camp, business league play, LGBTQ inclusive social scrambles, golf for non-golfers, themed community gatherings like tea parties and donut days, and live performances and other events which are subject to our approval.

These offerings will make the space more welcoming and inclusive for a broad range of residents.

This partnership ensures that Green Lake Pitch and Pet remains a welcoming, accessible, and well-maintained community space.

We're confident that this agreement strengthens our long-term goals for equity, community engagement, and stewardship of our park resources.

And I'm happy to take any questions or comments at this time.

Thank you, Kathleen.

And I don't know if Christopher has anything as well.

No, I think Kathleen nailed it.

Awesome.

You did.

And I also want to defer to Councilmember Strauss.

This is in your district.

Thank you.

Right, correct?

I got the boundaries right.

Indeed.

Love pitch and putt.

Incorrectly called putt-putt during the golf discussions.

And colleagues, I do want to share, you know, compared to the last concession agreement that we saw just a couple minutes ago that did have a CPI inflator, this one does not.

And I'm okay with that.

I just am flagging that for you as we get into the discussions about amendments at the next committee, because I think this is a fair agreement.

Colleagues, something you may also not know is that when I took office, there was not a walking path around the exterior of the Pitch and Putt.

And so we were forcing people to walk in an unmaintained shoulder of the road to get from the parking lot to the front door of Pitch and Putt.

And with the help of Parks Department and SDOT, we were able to create That boundary walkway all the way around the Pitch and Putt.

Yes, there's already a walkabout path for Green Lake, but for the specific triangle that Pitch and Putt is on, we were able to create that walking path.

And so I just want to say thanks.

I'm ready to vote on this if you want to bring it to a vote today, Chair.

I guess my only...

I don't think you were intending to say that I was an unskilled golfer, but I can't do them in three.

Not intended at anyone.

I was more speaking of myself.

Don't give me a golf club.

I'm not sure what'll happen.

Back to you, Chair.

Awesome.

Thank you, Council Member Strauss.

I don't know if Council Member Rivera, if you had any questions.

No?

Council Member Kettle.

Council President Nelson, if you have any questions, just go ahead and throw your hand up.

Council Member Kettle.

Did I cut you off guard?

No questions, although I appreciate the invitation to swing by.

On the website, so thank you.

I do have one last thing, but I'll save it on the other business.

Okay, thank you.

Thank you, Councilmember Kettle.

Committee members, I don't know if you all feel comfortable with voting on this.

I do.

I know Councilmember Strauss does.

Awesome.

I'm getting thumbs up.

All right, awesome.

So, great.

I'm going to move.

I'm gonna move that the committee recommends adopting Council Bill 121038. Is there a second?

Second.

It's been moved and second to recommend the passage of the bill.

If there's any, I don't know if there's any further comments.

I'll stop and look left, right.

We're good.

All right.

Awesome.

We can go ahead.

Will you please call the roll?

Council member Kettle?

Aye.

Council member Rivera?

Aye.

Council member Strauss?

Yes.

Council President Nelson?

Council President Nelson?

Chair Hollingsworth?

Yes.

Four in favor, none opposed.

Awesome.

The motion carries and the committee's recommendation will be sent to Tuesday, July 29, 2025. Thank you, Kathleen.

Thank you, Mr. Christopher Williams.

Really appreciate you all being here.

Council Member Kettle?

Thank you, Chair.

I just wanted to note before our guests leave that, as you know, it always comes back to public safety for me.

I was going to ask an earlier question about Golden Gardens, but that's one type of public safety.

But then there's another part of public safety as it relates to parks.

And my question to you is, why was the letter A afraid to go to the park?

Oh, I am stumped.

Because it thought B was following it.

Okay.

Thank you, Council Member Cattle.

Thank you.

Thank you, Kathleen.

Thank you, Christopher.

I know, people on the Seattle Channel are probably like, get them off the stage.

Where's the Sandman coming at the Apollo Theater with the line and hook?

Okay, thank you everyone.

With that, we have no other items for today's agenda.

If there's no further business for the meeting, we will adjourn.

This is going to conclude our July 23rd meeting of Parks Public Utilities Technology.

Our next meeting, and colleagues, just for your awareness, and we'll let your office know, we have a pretty hefty agenda.

for August 13th at 2 p.m.

before we go into council recess.

So it's gonna be pretty jam-packed and we'll work as swiftly as possible through the agenda items, okay?

Thank you so much.

It is 3.35 p.m., meeting adjourned.